Comments on: Apology on the BBC Film Network http://z-studios.com/blog/2008/09/23/apology-on-the-bbc-film-network/ Thoughts on Machinima and Life, and whether the two can peacefully co-exist Sat, 10 Jan 2009 00:24:49 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5 By: Kate http://z-studios.com/blog/2008/09/23/apology-on-the-bbc-film-network/#comment-34284 Kate Wed, 24 Sep 2008 15:26:59 +0000 http://z-studios.com/blog/?p=376#comment-34284 It's a hard question to answer. People take differing cues about emotion from context and body language. The exact same same facial expression will be read differently at different times, and will actively attempt to interpret emotion through tone of voice, their own experience and expectations. Viewers will actively work to understand a story, and empathise with the characters. They will, and do see emotion in static faces, or an animator's pencil drawn lines, once they learn to 'decode' the media. Sometimes the ambiguous can be more powerful, because the viewer invests more of themselves in the experience. I think this is about the expectations that people bring when they view machinima for the first few times. If they are looking for alive human faces then they will get confused. Once viewers are enjoying a drama, they will get better at guessing the state of mind of the characters. It’s a hard question to answer. People take differing cues about emotion from context and body language. The exact same same facial expression will be read differently at different times, and will actively attempt to interpret emotion through tone of voice, their own experience and expectations. Viewers will actively work to understand a story, and empathise with the characters. They will, and do see emotion in static faces, or an animator’s pencil drawn lines, once they learn to ‘decode’ the media. Sometimes the ambiguous can be more powerful, because the viewer invests more of themselves in the experience. I think this is about the expectations that people bring when they view machinima for the first few times. If they are looking for alive human faces then they will get confused. Once viewers are enjoying a drama, they will get better at guessing the state of mind of the characters.

]]> By: Trace http://z-studios.com/blog/2008/09/23/apology-on-the-bbc-film-network/#comment-34251 Trace Wed, 24 Sep 2008 14:06:19 +0000 http://z-studios.com/blog/?p=376#comment-34251 Congrats Phil! Cool to see journalists acknowledging Machinima isn't just game orientated anymore, but much wider. I personally love Machinima because (at the moment at least) it doesn't have any rules set in stone that film and animation seem to have. There is room for classic techniques, but there is still the freedom to poke about and explore, hopefully create something new. Facial animations across the board need to be improved though. Showing community works to friends, they always mention the lack of emotion on the character's faces, especially in an emotional scene. I don't see it myself, because no doubt I'm used to seeing little facial movement, but it's an obvious gap between a Machinima viewer and a general viewer I've found. Congrats Phil! Cool to see journalists acknowledging Machinima isn’t just game orientated anymore, but much wider.

I personally love Machinima because (at the moment at least) it doesn’t have any rules set in stone that film and animation seem to have. There is room for classic techniques, but there is still the freedom to poke about and explore, hopefully create something new.

Facial animations across the board need to be improved though. Showing community works to friends, they always mention the lack of emotion on the character’s faces, especially in an emotional scene. I don’t see it myself, because no doubt I’m used to seeing little facial movement, but it’s an obvious gap between a Machinima viewer and a general viewer I’ve found.

]]> By: CurtisC http://z-studios.com/blog/2008/09/23/apology-on-the-bbc-film-network/#comment-34224 CurtisC Wed, 24 Sep 2008 03:40:09 +0000 http://z-studios.com/blog/?p=376#comment-34224 I have to agree on the facials. This is the main reason we can't use Antics at this point. We are experimenting with machinima Softskills training and the facials are key to the most rudimentary exercises. We found the new Iclone 3 combined with the Crazytalk to be adequate for our tests. Even the most simplistic emotional context can create a basic emotional connection with a trainee. Cheers Curtis I have to agree on the facials. This is the main reason we can’t use Antics at this point. We are experimenting with machinima Softskills training and the facials are key to the most rudimentary exercises. We found the new Iclone 3 combined with the Crazytalk to be adequate for our tests. Even the most simplistic emotional context can create a basic emotional connection with a trainee.
Cheers
Curtis

]]> By: 3dfilmmaker http://z-studios.com/blog/2008/09/23/apology-on-the-bbc-film-network/#comment-34153 3dfilmmaker Tue, 23 Sep 2008 16:28:52 +0000 http://z-studios.com/blog/?p=376#comment-34153 Ya, you shouldn't throw out over a hundred years of camera language just because there are new tools/techniques. If you understand the grammar and have practiced it, then go to town, it is motivated and will be filled with deeper meaning. It can be tricky though... 'did that guy jump the line of action because he didn't know what it was or because it was motivated?' (i.e. to subliminally upset the audience in line with the context of the scene).. In Battlestar Galactica you don't question it, in a low budget machinima production you do. This is why in BW games I keep things 'traditional' because its easy for people to assume unprofessionalism in the context of a game. In this case the language of film becomes even more important. I don't think machinima will have a new grammer of shots anymore than saying 'bullet time' created a new genre of film. And the facial thing... photorealism isn't the end all of emotional storytelling... you can have a closeup of a scribbled stickman and still feel something (See: The Journey ;) Ken Ya, you shouldn’t throw out over a hundred years of camera language just because there are new tools/techniques. If you understand the grammar and have practiced it, then go to town, it is motivated and will be filled with deeper meaning. It can be tricky though… ‘did that guy jump the line of action because he didn’t know what it was or because it was motivated?’ (i.e. to subliminally upset the audience in line with the context of the scene).. In Battlestar Galactica you don’t question it, in a low budget machinima production you do. This is why in BW games I keep things ‘traditional’ because its easy for people to assume unprofessionalism in the context of a game. In this case the language of film becomes even more important.

I don’t think machinima will have a new grammer of shots anymore than saying ‘bullet time’ created a new genre of film. And the facial thing… photorealism isn’t the end all of emotional storytelling… you can have a closeup of a scribbled stickman and still feel something (See: The Journey ;)

Ken

]]> By: Ricky Grove http://z-studios.com/blog/2008/09/23/apology-on-the-bbc-film-network/#comment-34152 Ricky Grove Tue, 23 Sep 2008 16:24:37 +0000 http://z-studios.com/blog/?p=376#comment-34152 Congrats on the exposure for Apology, Overman. The film (and you) sure deserve it. Your poster has some good points (as well as Buddy) and I agree with most of them as well. I've always maintained that machinima filmmakers need to branch out more in style. Anime is an untapped source for style. Borrowing camera moves and shot selection and then tweaking them to suit your film would result in different style for a machinima film, one that would look less like mainstream film. Anime has a tradition of ignoring established film language. And I sure agree with you about facial animation; even simple expressions can be very effective in conveying emotion. Buddy's division of Machinima groups seems right to me, although I think there is plenty of crossover within the groups. Congrats on the exposure for Apology, Overman. The film (and you) sure deserve it.

Your poster has some good points (as well as Buddy) and I agree with most of them as well. I’ve always maintained that machinima filmmakers need to branch out more in style. Anime is an untapped source for style. Borrowing camera moves and shot selection and then tweaking them to suit your film would result in different style for a machinima film, one that would look less like mainstream film. Anime has a tradition of ignoring established film language.

And I sure agree with you about facial animation; even simple expressions can be very effective in conveying emotion.

Buddy’s division of Machinima groups seems right to me, although I think there is plenty of crossover within the groups.

]]> By: Buddy_DoQ http://z-studios.com/blog/2008/09/23/apology-on-the-bbc-film-network/#comment-34143 Buddy_DoQ Tue, 23 Sep 2008 15:50:36 +0000 http://z-studios.com/blog/?p=376#comment-34143 There seems to me 3 distinct groups of Machinimators coming out in this age: Gamers, Anymators, & Animators. Gamers are all about the fan-fare, or using a game/engine they really like to tell a story. Not too much else going on with it (in a technical sense). I think most of us started out this way. This will be the group that has the most die-hard fans, and game-job employment ops for the more talented teams. See: RvB Anymators are all about telling a story in any way they can. Maybe they take WoW characters in a model viewer with some green screen, lay'em over a Sims 2 back drop, and so forth. They are likely to use iClone/MovieStorm type tools. This will be the group that reigns over YouTube and the like. See: Male Restroom Etiquette Animators are those suckers who somehow think Machinima is a good replacement for scanline and raytracing. (Yeah, I'm a sucker. =/) This will be the group that will knock down the big walls of traditional acceptance and will dominate the old-school festivals, but I can easily see them missing the boat the Anymators will bank-roll on, because they can never be satisfied by anything less than total control... It's this total control that makes the old film conventions a mere mater of wanting them, but the cost is losing out on the inherent real-time benefits. See: Person2184 I guess what I'm saying is, with Machinima, it's impossible to call it out for being one thing or another. Missing one aspect of the moving arts or another. At this point, it all comes down to the directors, and what they wish to present to their audience. Welcome to the future, baby! There seems to me 3 distinct groups of Machinimators coming out in this age: Gamers, Anymators, & Animators.

Gamers are all about the fan-fare, or using a game/engine they really like to tell a story. Not too much else going on with it (in a technical sense). I think most of us started out this way. This will be the group that has the most die-hard fans, and game-job employment ops for the more talented teams. See: RvB

Anymators are all about telling a story in any way they can. Maybe they take WoW characters in a model viewer with some green screen, lay’em over a Sims 2 back drop, and so forth. They are likely to use iClone/MovieStorm type tools. This will be the group that reigns over YouTube and the like. See: Male Restroom Etiquette

Animators are those suckers who somehow think Machinima is a good replacement for scanline and raytracing. (Yeah, I’m a sucker. =/) This will be the group that will knock down the big walls of traditional acceptance and will dominate the old-school festivals, but I can easily see them missing the boat the Anymators will bank-roll on, because they can never be satisfied by anything less than total control… It’s this total control that makes the old film conventions a mere mater of wanting them, but the cost is losing out on the inherent real-time benefits. See: Person2184

I guess what I’m saying is, with Machinima, it’s impossible to call it out for being one thing or another. Missing one aspect of the moving arts or another. At this point, it all comes down to the directors, and what they wish to present to their audience. Welcome to the future, baby!

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